Ruthie Bowles is a US Army Veteran, mom to four kids, and lives in Maryland with her family, goats, and chickens. She focuses on bringing awareness to the unethical tactics and strategies in the small business coaching and consulting industry. Ruthie is also an audiobook narrator.
She joins OTC this episode to talk about the difference between work-life balance and work-life harmony. Too often we try to juggle everything all at once rather than looking for how we can do some ebb and flow. Ruthie also talks with us in this episode about teasing out powerful coaches and consultants from those who are just out to pitch slap you. While everyone can use a great coach, Ruthie warns about those with unhealthy marketing and sales tactics that are all about selling hot air and not results.
References you might find interesting:
If this is your first time with OTC, check out EPISODE 1: START HERE for more background on the show.
Our True Colors is sponsored by True Culture Coaching & Consulting. Head to our website to find out how True Culture Coaching and Consulting can support you and your organization. You can find us at truecultureconsulting.com where you can also contact us to schedule a free consultation.
Ruthie Bowles is a US Army Veteran, mom to four kids, and lives in Maryland with her family, goats, and chickens. She focuses on bringing awareness to the unethical tactics and strategies in the small business coaching and consulting industry. Ruthie is also an audiobook narrator.
She joins OTC this episode to talk about the difference between work-life balance and work-life harmony. Too often we try to juggle everything all at once rather than looking for how we can do some ebb and flow. Ruthie also talks with us in this episode about teasing out powerful coaches and consultants from those who are just out to pitch slap you. While everyone can use a great coach, Ruthie warns about those with unhealthy marketing and sales tactics that are all about selling hot air and not results.
References you might find interesting:
If this is your first time with OTC, check out EPISODE 1: START HERE for more background on the show.
Our True Colors is sponsored by True Culture Coaching & Consulting. Head to our website to find out how True Culture Coaching and Consulting can support you and your organization. You can find us at truecultureconsulting.com where you can also contact us to schedule a free consultation.
Intro 00:06
Welcome to our True Colors hosted by Shawna Gann. Join her as she explores the challenges of being a racial riddle, an ethnic enigma, and a cultural conundrum. Let's dive in.
Shawna 00:19
Hey, Yolandie, what's up?
Yolandie 00:21
Not a whole lot. What's going on?
Shawna 00:22
Well, I am deciding on some new habits, or I'm trying to. I like how I've made the decision. We'll see how it goes. But that's what I'm working on these days.
Yolandie 00:33
What's the top habit you're working on?
Shawna 00:36
Moving… my body. I've decided, I've been inside, I need to start taking walks. Before we jumped on, I was talking about my dogs. So they are now getting a morning walk instead of the occasional afternoon walk. That’s what I’m working on.
Yolandie 00:54
I feel you. I've been trying to get to sleep earlier. And I did all the things on the phone with the digital wellness and like, it shuts everything off except my Kindle and my alarm. So I can't access anything after 9pm. And it has helped maybe a little. Now I just read for like an hour and a half before I fall asleep instead of going to sleep like I should. So.
Shawna 01:19
My husband and I met at Barnes and Noble. We love books. And we have over the years from all the moving. Like that's the first thing we shed when it's trying, but now we're settled. So it's like, okay, we really have to be careful of our book intake. But the bad part is because of the digital world now and what I've been into, we buy the books, and then they become aspirational reads on the shelf, or I get the audio version, listen to it while I'm doing all the things. And then still like every once in a while, like touch my pages. There's something good about just having paper, right?
Yolandie 01:55
I found that to read a book really fast, I will get the audio version and the physical version and play the audio version while I read the physical version so that I'm forced to follow the words, and I can speed up the recording or slow it down. And if I need to. So if I want to read it faster, I'll just turn up the speed and my eyes have to follow and like nothing gets in my way. So I do both.
Shawna 02:16
I actually got through Shakespeare in high school because of audiobooks. It started with King Lear because it was just not happening. I'm like I cannot. But in those days, Yolandie, it was going to the library to check out this packet of audio tapes that I actually put into the tape player, push the button to rewind… There was no hey Siri, nothing, like it just happened.
Yolandie 02:46
I tried to explain to my son the card catalog in the library. And he's nine and he was like, “You had to do what?”
Shawna 02:54
Yeah, I don't understand. What is that?
Yolandie 02:56
Yeah, I was like when you want something, you open your computer and you type into Google and you find it. Are you going to YouTube and you find a video of how to do what you want to do. When I wanted to learn something at your age, I had to go to the library, I had to get up and leave my house, go to this place, find this thing that looked like a dresser with tiny drawers and pull out all these individual alphabetized cards, then find the number, write the number down and then take that number to the corresponding place on the shelf. If I'm lucky, I found it.
Shawna 03:23
If you’re lucky. But come on now. There's something so charming about like actual typewritten index cards, and the tiny little library pencils - right? - on both scrap papers.
Yolandie 03:34
Pencils in the scrap paper still exist. I’m still a library lover, but there's no more cards.
Shawna 03:40
I haven't been in a library since COVID-ness, but that's cool. I'm still down with my audiobooks. And this is really, a really great segue because our guest today is also down with audiobooks. She's an audiobook narrator. So thank goodness for audio. Let's go ahead and introduce our guest because she's amazing. Her name is Ruthie Bowles. And she's a US Army veteran, a mom to four kids and she lives in Maryland with her family, her goats and her chickens. And she focuses on bringing awareness to the unethical tactics and strategies in the small business coaching and consulting industry. Ruthie, as I mentioned, is also an audiobook narrator. Hey, Ruthie, what's up?
Ruthie 04:20
What's up? Yes! I’m so excited.
Shawna 04:23
I'm so glad you're here. We have been trying to make this happen for a long time. I met Ruthie last year. And we've talked a couple of times. One of those times she was like “Hey, so is it cool - I have to milk my goats right now.” I was like, Amazing! Yes. So we chatted during some chores.
04:47
Yep, yep, had to milk the goats and do chicken stuff and filter the milk and whatnot. And I do to save this– like if you schedule something in the morning or in the evening, like that's dinnertime and we're in the same timezone, so I'm like, either you're cool with this or you're not, but these kids gotta eat and this goat gets ornery if you don't milk her on time. So?
Shawna 05:07
I get it, I get it, I get ornery too when things ain’t happening when they’re supposed to be happening, so I don’t blame her or you. No, I thought that was really cool. Well, I know I introduced you but I'd like to hear from you. And would you just tell us a little bit about yourself?
05:23
Absolutely. Well first things first, the only reason why there's room on this bookshelf is because I did a library donation run. And I because I like– I have loved to read since I was a kid. And the library was one of my refuges because I am one of six children when books are expensive, especially pre Kindle days. So the library was where I went. And so I joined the Army out of Pennsylvania, but I'm from California. And I actually met my husband in Afghanistan. And part of his courtship was giving me my first ever eReader because I was scrounging the free book boxes in Afghanistan, always looking for a book, I was ordering books, like I was doing all the things. And then he told me he's like, I don't like this e reader, you should have it. And I was like, “bla bla bla bla bla. Okay, thanks” Completely stupid, unaware of the fact that he was interested. And that was his way of communicating it. So yeah. So we've been together since since then. And now we live in Maryland. But I've been all over the United States. And my kids have– almost– my kids… Two of my kids were born in Maryland. But one was born in Georgia. And one was born in Germany. And he's adopted. But yeah, like, I didn't know that I loved goats and chickens and stuff. But I was a bodybuilder for a while. And that got me wise to the clean eating and the stuff that they put in the animals that we then eat and all that stuff. And I was like, Well, how can I fix that? And it's like, well, I can support, you know, farms that are conscious of those things. And slash or, I could have some of my own animals. That's what we do. We eat our chicken eggs, we have our goat milk. And that's how we roll these days.
Shawna 07:10
Wow. How long have you been doing that?
07:13
Let's see. The chickens? I was blessed with chickens through my realtor about six weeks after we moved into the house here, because we're on two acres here. And she had some people who needed to get rid of their chickens like she had just gotten– And I was like, Cool. So we ended up with our first chickens in 2017. And then the goats came to us. I got them in May of 2020. And that that was how the [unclear]-- We’re coming up on our second year with with milking goats.
Shawna 07:41
Wow. Yolandie, you down with chickens?
Yolandie 07:44
My soon to be in laws had chickens, they just, they all, I don't know if they slaughtered them to eat them. If they died, whatever. They don't have them anymore. But they used to complain that they couldn't travel ever because they had to stay and monitor the chickens or find somebody to do it for them. And that became a burden.
Shawna 08:04
I didn’t think about that part.
08:06
That is certainly part of it. It's not a hurdle I've had to crush just yet. Because COVID. And I have four kids that are just now kind of getting to the point where it's like vacationing isn't such a big deal. My youngest actually turns four today. And she can use the toilet and stuff which makes traveling like a whole nother thing, right? But when I, when we have gone, before COVID, we did go on one vacation, but it was pre goats. And that's the trick. Like for chickens, that's one thing, to find somebody to come get some eggs and like pour some food in the thing. That's not a big deal. But to find somebody who can also milk a goat, who is comfortable with that, that's a little bit of a different thing. So I haven't yet had to face that hurdle at the moment. But we do have some people in the area that you know, I would trust to do so. It would probably just be a matter of them learning how to milk my goat.
Shawna 08:59
Right. Rover. Rover, if you're listening? Well, Ruthie, you told us that you met your husband in Afghanistan. You've been in all of these places, but you're not in the army anymore. Tell us what you're up to and how you got there.
09:13
Okay, so what I'm up to now… 2020 was a year and then 2021 was like part two of 2020. So I just I just want to throw that out there. So I spent the first like few months of 2020 like, like that kid in the video where they just come from the dentist and he's like, Is this real life? Is this still happening? Because that’s how I felt for the first like good few months of 2020. Like post post the announcement of the world shutting down. That's how I felt. And the thing is, is right before 2020, or before COVID, so like I would say February. I had like my highest earning month yet in terms of my content marketing business. So I was– I wrote content for companies, mostly in the b2b space, like their white papers, their ebooks, website content, all that stuff, and I had had my highest earning month up to that point and then bam world shuts down. And it's funny because it's not even like I lost a whole bunch of clients or anything, because my clients were b2b companies who still needed to function because their clients still needed them. But it just really had me questioning, like, the type of impact and stuff that I wanted to have. And, and so I started thinking more carefully about my clients that I was taking on, and the work that I was doing for them. So it was in May, that I ended up letting go of one of my bigger clients, because they had let go of their CMO. And I was interacting directly with some people that I had not interacted with before. And it was not an enjoyable experience. I started experiencing anxiety every time I saw an email from them, and I saw emails from them at the weirdest times. And I was like, why are y'all even still like working? Like, what are you doing? Go to bed! I'm not answering this. But even not answering it, I still knew it was there. Yeah. And so I started turning off all my notifications. And I was like, Wait a second. I'm not an employee. I don't have to do this if I don't want to. So I was like, Okay, I gotta let y'all go. Bye.. And continuing on with that theme,
11:18
I ended up signing with some small business coaches. And this is part of what led me to ,what you mentioned, when you introduced me is, is increasing the awareness around these tactics, because, and I've talked about this on my podcast and whatnot. But I ended up spending like, $30,000 with these people. And it did not give what it was supposed to have gave. Yeah, it was not that– You see the thing is, is I say that, but I like– it's not uncommon in this space, especially– This is the thing about entrepreneurship is there are people out here who will make all types of promises. And we get this impression that it's part of the entrepreneur mindset, right? That you make investments in yourself, because you're your most important resource, you know, how is your business going to run without you, at least until you get to the point where it can run without you. And everybody needs a coach? Right? I don't know if you've heard that yet. But people say that, like they put it on LinkedIn, Facebook, everybody needs a coach. Right, coaches need coaches, and then the coaches who coach coaches need coaches and then you got coach ception going on. And, and so I thought I was making entrepreneur moves, right? Invested in myself.
12:35
And what I didn't realize was that they, and again, it's not uncommon at all, it's very common, but they employed all types of like manipulation and cult tactics, and all this other stuff, a lot of the same things that you see in a lot of MLMs. Actually, you know, once I realized that I was being had, I ended up on some very interesting paths. I explored, like the nature of authenticity, I switched my major over to social psychology, because it wasn't marketing, but I hated it. Because I was constantly arguing with the teachers for my marketing degree because their shit was outdated. And then I started exploring the nature of consciousness, and what sparks creativity, because I was like, We cannot continue on this way. And so that's where I've kind of centered things, at least, like for my own podcast that just had a rebrand, it's called the critically conscious coach. And I was like, You know what, though, while this is a space I want to work in, whether it's working with coaches to make sure that they stay, you know, on the proper side of their own ethics, or if it's, you know, helping people kind of navigate making these decisions for their businesses. Like, I don't want to put out something that's going to be much like the same of, of everything else that we've seen. So that's how I started audiobook narrating.
Shawna 13:49
Oh, wow.
Ruthie 13:51
I was like, you still need to make money. So.
Shawna 13:54
I am both a consultant and a coach, and work in this DEI space, which means that ethics is mad important to me. And so I'm really curious about what kinds of things you are exploring, because I know at least with the consulting piece, consultants have a bad name sometimes, you know, like people– There are certain professions where people just do the eye roll, where it's like, it's a necessary evil, and they're not down with it. And there's like this whole sort of fear or cautious approach to these professions. So I'm curious about what you have discovered, or what this space is like for you now, as you're thinking through this, having gone through your experience, and why it's important to people who are in consulting or coaching.
Ruthie 14:40
Yes, it's definitely two sides of of that, right? Like it's on one side, if you're worried about it. And then on the other side, if you're in that space, like how can how can we make sure that we're doing better and clearly communicate the differences between us and others, who may not yet be at that point where they're examining the ethics of things. But some of the big things that I have found is that the pitch slappers, people who lead with a pitch slap on Facebook or LinkedIn, have probably already learned how to do a lot of the things that I am now saying are bad. Don't do it. And I think part of that, like even just that one thing there is that they are treating you like a number. They don't actually have a specific interest in, in reaching out to you. What their goal is hopefully get enough people to answer back. Kind of like spam mail in your inbox or, or spam mail in your actual mailbox, right? You throw it away. And so they will pretend that they're interested in you. But the goal really is just to get you on a phone call. What typically happens next,
15:46
and to be fair, most small business coaches are actually bad consultants. They are bad business consultants, because they're not actually coaching you on anything, they are going to train you on how to do what it is that they're doing, usually. But their goal is to get you on a call. And they have a very scripted process that they run you through that involves a lot of emotional anchoring. So one of the phases, and this is– Because remember, you gotta remember, I paid money to learn how to do this stuff, right? So part of it is okay, so we're gonna get you to visualize and be like, Oh, okay, so why is it so important that you achieve these types of goals in your business, whatever revenue goal that you've told these people you want to have? And they'll say, Okay, so tell us why it's so important. So they ask you for details. So you visualize it right? So then they make your hopes very vivid and along the forefront of your mind. And they asked you to imagine how good it would feel once you're actually able to accomplish that, right? Because the mind doesn't super distinguish between when you're imagining something versus when you're remembering it,
16:43
so it brings up the emotions and your body experiences those emotions in real time. And then they will often shift to, And what's getting in the way of that? And what will happen if you don't achieve your goals? Right? And so then that's when they start to bring in the fear. Right? And so there's emotional anchoring on on a positive side and a negative side. Right? And they haven't yet actually talked about anything important. Like that's, that's relating to the actual business side of things, right? And if you try to take control during these calls, they will try to wrest it back from you. So if you're like, Well, wait, let me interview you. Let me ask you some questions. They're like, No, like, I need to be in control of this, right? Because the goal is not to lose control of the sales call. And so that entire process, it leads up to the point where you're like, Okay, well, how much is it? And they tell you, whatever the number is, like, it's $9,000, $15,000, whatever the number is, $3,000. And then you're like, Oh, I, you know what, that's pretty expensive. I need to think about it. Their goal is to not let you get off the phone, because they got to find out, do you have the money and you're intimidated? Or do you not have the money and they gotta talk you into getting the money. And, and they are not above asking for your bill money. Like, and this is– Somebody who was listening to my podcast reached out and they– we talked about an experience they had and she was like, Yeah, like I told him that if I paid him this, I would not have money for my bills. And he was talking about how I would double my investment.
18:05
So you've got these false guarantees. They may also imply false exclusivity, ie, they would absolutely say no to you if they thought you weren't a good fit. But the fact is, is that they let everybody in. So it is this false exclusivity. Or it'll be a false scarcity. Oh, we only have two spots left. So you know, don't don't take too long making a decision, I don't want you to miss out on this opportunity. And they spend the whole time acting like they're on your side. So… And you see a lot of the same things in the marketing, a lot of the same things that you see on the sales call with the fear based marketing, the income claim marketing, where they talk about how, Oh, we've gotten– Our clients are seeing 15k months, or, We just made $70,000 this month. So.
Yolandie 18:43
So I'm curious, because I'm a personal style and confidence coach, and I have a friend who is also a coach with neurodivergent and trauma affected entrepreneurs, helping them get started up. And she and I had this very long discussion one day about using coach in our title. I resisted it for a long time, as did she, because of people that do things like that. But is there a way that some of these tactics might show up in someone who is valid and really is on your side? Because I do, in my consultations, like I asked the questions up front, like, You know, what is it that you're trying to do with me? What is it that is important to you about, you know, learning this for your style? And then I explain what it is that I do with my process, and then follow up with letting them have the floor to give any questions. So how do you differentiate between someone who is using tactics or you know, strategy that sounds very similar to this and is on your side versus someone who is just out for your money, no matter what?
Ruthie 19:42
So this is the thing, is that there's a difference between asking the questions because you want to understand somebody's motivation. And, there's, an, on that– But on the flip side of that you if the questions are meant to elicit a very emotional response… So when they were digging, right? So you say some of the surface stuff. But the goal is to, with these questions, they don't just ask one, like they are digging, because they want you to have an emotional response. So when you ask your questions, and you create this environment where it can be very trust based, you're accepting those answers. But you have to examine, you know, what your course actually is. So when I told them that, you know, it would make things a lot easier for my family, if I was able to reach a certain revenue amount, they continued to persist and continue to dig into that. And so eventually, it was like, Well, honestly, there's a pandemic going on right now
20:35
and my husband's immunocompromised. And I would love it if he could just stay home, period. Because remember, I thought we were all going to die at this point. So like, it'd be great if this man could stay home and not get sick. But that wasn't my intention. To reveal, you know? And so that's part of it, is it's not it's not the question so much in and of themselves, although some of those questions, like I said, if they're, if the intent is to dig, that definitely becomes a problem–
Shawna 20:57
Especially on a sales call. Like you haven’t even started working.
Ruthie 21:01
And that's the other thing is we are getting into spaces, when you talk about mindset issues, and overcoming objections and helping people overcome their mental hurdles. The thing is, is I need you to be able to, without pressure and manipulation from me, I need you to at least be in such a headspace that you can say yes, and make this decision for yourself. Like, I should not have to drag you across the finish line here. And, and they are not above doing those types of things. Like they, they will drag you to the finish line, like you could just be the, you know, Sadness, in– What's that movie called? Shoot. The emotions movie. Inside Out. You know how drags Sadness through the aisles. Like that's them. And you are sadness, and you just be laying there, they will drag you by your leg to get your credit card information.
Yolandie 21:52
See, I had when the pandemic hit, and I had my you know, epiphany that there's a better way to live life, I don't have to be punching the clock every day. And I was like, Alright, I'm going to do something. And style is my thing. That's what I'm going to do. I came across, you know, one of those master classes that you find on Facebook, and they're like, you know, learn all about blah, blah, blah. And I was like, Okay, let me check this out. And it opened my eyes to a lot of things, and did ultimately set me on the right path to get here where we are today. Otherwise, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. And I'd still be punching the clock. But at the end of that, I got a message on Facebook from the organizer. And it was like, you really stood out in class, you know, like, you asked a lot of questions, and you're like, very involved. And, you know, I was really impressed by you. And you know, I just wanted to see, were you planning on enrolling in the program, blah, blah, blah. And I was broke. Like, I didn't have it, there was no way. And I think it was close to $10,000 for this program. And I was like, it provides some of the things I need, but not everything. And then, so I was like, No, I don't think I can right now. Like I'm working on my finances. And the conversation then escalated to, there are financing options, you know, like I do payment plans. And I was like, Well, that's good to know. But I still like I can't do the payment plan either. That's just out of my reach right now. And there was like a subsequent message that basically, she didn't quite outright say like, you know, don't pay your bills. But it was like, you know, you could potentially go to your bank and get a loan, you know that they have better interest rates sometimes. And I was like, I'm sorry, you want me to do what? You want me to go get a loan for your program? Are you out of your mind?
[Crosstalk]
Yeah, exactly red flag. Well, it gets better, because there was a second class that she held. And I was like, Well, let me attend it again. Because you always get new things out of something that you learned. It’s like reading a book twice, you never catch all the same details. And so I went through it again. And at the end of this class, I got the same message like the same canned… It was like, Do not see the previous messages up here that you already sent me like this exact same message.
Shawna 24:08
Cuz that's an automation.
Ruthie 24:09
It’s automation, or they paid somebody to do it and that person does not get paid enough to scroll up and see the previous messages. They get paid enough to copy and paste that in there. Which makes it even worse because you'd be like, But I was interested and I was asking questions, but now I know you actually weren't caring about that. This is just a copy paste message.
Yolandie 24:30
Yeah. And I was just rubbed like such the wrong way that now when I do any kinds of consults with clients and I send the follow up email thanking them for their time I make sure I tell them like, I really want you to be sure this is what you want to do. I want you to be like a full body, Hell Yes. Or it's a no right now and come back when you can answer with the hell yes, because I want you to be ready for it. And I don't want you to feel pressured whatsoever. And if I had not had that experience, I don't know that I would be as lenient, I guess is the word that I want. Forgiving? To let them have that space to work it out. So I really, really love that you are drawing attention to these tactics, because they're out there. Vultures.
Ruthie 25:11
They are. Well, that's the thing is that sometimes they talk about, like their intent and stuff. But I think for us as coaches and consultants, should we be pitching people who don't have capital? who are not yet generating revenue? Should I be looking you in your face? And you're like, hey, actually, I don't have the resources for that, like, my business is not earning that. And I'm like, well, that's fine, you should go get a loan and give me my $10,000. Like, how is that a healthy business decision? In no other place, in no other industry, do we look at potential clients and we're like, Yeah, I know, you're not making money, but you have access to money that you should give to me. Is this even a good business decision? And if I'm helping you with your business in some capacity or another, can I ethically sit here and take your last pennies when I'm supposed to be helping you grow your business somehow? Is there not something else you should be doing?
Shawna 26:04
Right. And that's what I was just gonna say, it's like, well, first of all, can I trust you to be the person to help me if off, like, right out the gate, you're giving me bad advice, just to pay. And secondly, that's the tricky thing about capitalism in the coaching world. And especially if you go through a program and really become certified, and you're passing boards, and you're part of, you know, ICF, or some other accredited coaching programs, you know, there are definitely ethical things, you know, built into that. But is selling your services including that? It's usually about the engagement itself. And so no, these are very, these are very important things to consider. And the other thing I was gonna bring up, you talked about sort of this coaching, consulting dynamic. There are two different things, two vastly different things. You know, consultants are designed to give you solutions. They listen to what the problem is, they want to know what you've done. So there's some similarity, right? Both both want to know what's going on, both want to know what you've done already, so far, to sort of get you where you are. And where the road kind of forks, is consultants are like, Alright, here's what we're going to do. We're going to assess the situation, we're going to look at what you got, here's what our findings are. And this is what we recommend. You can take it or leave it. If you want to take it, we can help you keep driving it home, right? Coaches are like, Okay, what's going on? What have you done, and then starts the questions to sort of help you find it within yourself rather than solutioning. And I think it's important for folks to know that those are two different things, because people are like, Oh, my God with the questions, I just want you to give me advice. And that's when it's like, well, maybe you need a consultant. Coaches do help you or they should be helping you take action, help you move forward. But it's really like you finding those pathways yourself, but then facilitating that process. So two things: One, consulting and coaching are different things. It's important to know that. And two, we really have to think about the true ethics behind how we're actually selling services. Nobody's out to be gettin pitch slapped. I will be saying that for the next three weeks. Thank you, Ruthie.
Ruthie 28:24
You’re welcome. Well, this was why I was saying they were bad consultants, though. Because no matter what you tell them, their answer, their solution, is always the same. So they're calling themselves coaches, and they're often not, and they're actually consultants, but they're bad consultants, because a real, a true consultant worth their salt is going to hear what you have to say, and I'm sure you know, they're gonna hear what you have to say. And they're going to give you a solution based on what you've actually said, versus them just letting you run your mouth because they've already got this cookie cutter solution in mind, and they serve the same thing up to everybody. Like you, specifically, your problem deserves peanut butter cookies, but their recipe is chocolate chip cookies all the way, no peanut butter, and they're just gonna give you that one and tell you that that's going to solve your problems, even though we all know that what you need is peanut butter.
Shawna 29:08
That's right. Yeah. So can I– I want to rewind a little bit when you were talking about switching to this new role and things that you've got going on? You were talking about a client that you had to let go, because of the odd times they were reaching out to you and all that stuff. And I've seen like commercials and all the things where people are like, Hey, if you are an entrepreneur, if you start your own business, you're gonna just be working all the time. And, you know, like you don't get any time to yourself, and whatever, but you're just out there. You know, you're tearing it up. That's kind of the life of an entrepreneur, or my new favorite, especially if you're a solopreneur. [Crosstalk] And so I just you know, I love, number one, that you realize like yo, I don't have to do this. You know, there is a pressure out there where people feel like you can't say no, you can't turn away business, you know, but in the end, it's a relationship. And you've got to ask if it's a healthy relationship, and are you going to be healthy. I'd really love for you to talk a bit about what that was like for you, making that decision to choose you, and, and to start to discern what a healthy client relationship looks like.
Ruthie 30:31
So I became an entrepreneur, because I was choosing me. I was pregnant with my daughter. And I had, we had moved into this house and I started, part time, I was a freelance writer, I was doing content writing, and I made that decision for me. And when I made my decision to quit my job, I was a federal contractor, that was also for me, to help me find more happiness in my life, you know. I was not yet 30 at the time. And I was like, Look, I could have been blown up over there, God. I could have been blown up. I did not do all of that just to come over here and be unhappy, like I didn't come back to be unhappy. And so I was very sensitive to it kind of from the beginning, you know. It's easy to be really excited and motivated and do extra work. But the trick then becomes when you set that expectation that you're always reachable, for example, and you don't want to be reachable, then it becomes a problem.
31:34
So it was partly– It was exploring my own boundaries, but also understanding and accepting that sometimes, like all of us have boundaries. And sometimes they touch or overlap a little bit. And sometimes there's a gulf in between them. And I have to be okay with accepting that. And it's not to say I never send emails at weird times, but I always end the– If it's a weird time, I'm always on the email with a, I know, it's Saturday, I just had a minute to write this up and I didn't want to forget. I'll hear from you on Monday, or whenever you get to this. Right? Just to put it in there. But I already have a job that I have to do all of the time. And that's be a mom. So I can't– You can't have two jobs where you got to do it all the time. Right. And I am a human being. And it's part of my firm belief that as part of my human experience, I should be seeking joy and peace and contentment. That was just kind of how I felt about it and how I've always felt about it. But that's not to say that sometimes I'm not working harder. And I think that's where the work life harmony part comes in. When it's work life balance, I always visualized a teeter totter.
32:40
And you're standing in the middle of the teeter totter, constantly trying to balance it, you know, but you're super shaky. Because you're not in Cirque du Soleil. You can't make a perfect balance, right? Like the vast majority of us. So it's always shaky, and you're like, oh, and then sometimes you fall off and everything falls to pieces. And so when I started toying with the idea of like a work life harmony, it's like when you listen to an orchestra, not everybody is playing at 100% the whole time, right. And it flows and ebbs in such a way to create this beautiful masterpiece. But everything kind of comes in its time and in its turn. So there are some times where I do need to work late or I need to, you know, do a bit more. But there's also times like last week, we had spring break, I could not work as much. And it was still wretched. I didn't even work as much and it was still wretched. So it is what it is. But if I had tried to hold myself to the same level of productivity during last week, as I do during normal weeks, it would have been horrifyingly bad. And that would have been me on the teeter totter and then falling off and then everything collapses. So I– That's why I try to strive for work life harmony, so that way I can flex as I need to. And that's a lot easier for me to plan and balance with my husband to explain to my children, the ones who are old enough to get it, like, Hey, I know this isn't what we wanted to do today, but mommy's in a bit of a work flex right now. That's kind of where that came from.
Shawna 34:04
Yeah, I mean, it makes so much sense. And as you were describing the orchestra, I was also thinking about my days in choir where the director would be kind of, you know, pulling the Altos out this way. Okay, okay, back it up. Now, let's hear the sopranos, okay? Tenors bring it, right. Like, yeah, you have to kind of do that push-pull. You know? I think that's important. I love how you describe that.
Yolandie 34:25
I love that you embraced the fact that your life is not to work. And the work is to support your life. I had shared this with her earlier that when I still had a job when I was still punching the clock, probably about the last four to five years that I was doing that I would say to coworkers or to my boss that I have a life work balance and they were like, You mean work life balance? I was like, No. Life work balance. My life comes first and then the work. So I will take care of my life and then I will come to work. And you're going to– your second place. That's all there is to it. I'm sorry. and they all looked at me like, What are you talking about, like life work? Like, yeah, I have a life, don't you? Like? Do you just like live, eat and breathe this place because I certainly don't. And they just didn't understand. And I think that that is a huge contributor to this great resignation that we've got going on that people are like finally waking up to, Hey, you don't own my life, you own my work time. So I'll show up from nine to five, and you get those hours and beyond that, don't call me Don't email me, don't expect me to respond. And don't be mad when I don't.
Ruthie 35:31
Right. And if you're the owner of a business, you cannot expect your employees to show up with the same vigor that you do. Like if this business is truly your passion, that's where, you know– You can still burn out and still do all that stuff. But that's where it becomes, because it feeds you, it feeds like your heart, you know? But I cannot expect my teammates to do stuff, just because that's when I would do it. I can't do that, because I'm the business owner. And it's my passion. It's not theirs.
Shawna 36:00
So this is an expectation now, and it's really an interesting shift in values. Geographically, people are spread out all over the place. You know, technology has changed how people can work. Add that to the unrealistic expectations that might come from business owners or from senior leadership. And you know, even other countries are like, Hey– I think it's Belgium. – Listen, it's actually not legal to send emails with an expected response, or things like that, after a certain time, because health is important. And those things begin to deteriorate people's health, you know. There's tricks you can do. Like, I like to schedule emails, because sometimes I sit down to write or respond to a bunch of emails, or I've got to send things out. So I'll draft it up and then do the scheduled send, so that it sends Monday at whatever time. So that way, I still get to get it off my to do list, but it doesn't impact the receiver of that, you know? There's other ways that we can set up things so that you can still live that passion, but also have respect for your employees. Well, this has been really such a great conversation. I knew it would be. Learned some stuff from you. I’ll be thinking, you know, I'm not trying to be out here pitch slapping nobody. I know, it's like the fifth time I've said it, I can't even help it.
Ruthie 37:32
You’ll have to see my pitch slap TikToks then.
Shawna 37:35
Well, tell us. Where all can we find you?
Ruthie 37:37
So my consultancies name is Defy the Status Quo. So if you search that in Google, you will find probably everything. On Tik Tok, I've shifted my presence there a little bit. So now it's like a blend of both. But there's a lot of audiobook content on my TikTok, but I still have those pitch slaps ones. I act out both sides of the pitch slap with one of my favorite filters on TikTok is that green screen eyeballs and mouth. And so then I just do both sides. Right? But I tell you what, I imagined what the pitch slapper is really thinking ie I don't actually care about your answer. I just need you to respond. So that way I can pitch you - type of thing.
Shawna 38:20
Oh my gosh, well check out read the stuff. Of course, everything will be in the show notes too. It has been such a pleasure. You're hilarious. And we really appreciate what you shared with us. I think consulting is important. Coaching is important. We want to be ethical, doing the right thing. So we're actually for real for real helping folks. Yeah, that's the point.
Ruthie 38:42
Thank you so much for having me.
Shawna 38:44
Such a pleasure, anytime. Hey y'all, thanks for hanging out. I do hope you enjoyed the show. Do check out the show notes so you can find out more about Ruthie and go check out the other episodes. Let me know what you think. If you have a topic that you'd like to have discussed, or someone that you think I should talk to, maybe it's you, reach out to me. You can find me at true colorscast.com or you can go check me out on LinkedIn and contact me there. This show is sponsored by True Colors Consulting, all things DEI - diversity, equity and inclusion. So check out the show notes for information on True Colors Consulting as well. In the meantime, be safe out there, y'all. I hope you're doing well. Please share a smile with someone. And, whenever you get the chance, find a way to make someone feel welcome. Love y'all. And I'll talk to you soon.
Outro 39:48
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